Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty


Greg Bradley
 

Pentax 75 6x7 F4.5 is very good:

The Milky Way a 6 panel Panorama photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

Rho Ophiuchi and Gum Nebula photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

Pentax 6 x 7 300mm F4 EDIF is very good. Don't have this one but seen lots from Marco Lorenzi that were outstanding.

Pentax 645 300mm F4 EDIF is also very good. I used this one extensively and got good results:

Running Chicken and NGC3576 photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

NGC6164 The Fighting Dragons of Ara photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

The non 300mm EDIF versions are not good and have a lot of CA but are fine for narrowband 
as Richard says.

The Large Magellanic Cloud in Hydrogen Alpha and Oxygen emissions photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

Pentax 168 F2.8 is very good wide open:

Sagittarius 4panel mosaic.jpg photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com


The Pentax 55mm F4.5 is OK stopped down to F5.6.:

Vela Supernova Remnant Widefield 4 hours 20 minutes photo - Greg Bradley photos at pbase.com

I use all the above wide open except the 300mm F4EDIF where is use a stop down ring that makes it around F5.6.

Greg.


ayiomamitis
 

Richard,

What you describe below is precisely what one observes with cooled CCD images. With my ST-10XME, I recall thermal noise being 2-3 ADU whereas read noise was around 100 ADU (from memory). As for driving down noise by increasing the number of images in the stack, I agree that one gets limited returns as the sample size (ie stacked images) increases. Again, using my own personal experience, anything around 16 to 20 images in the stack is optimal, for additional images in the stack have a minor further effect on the S/N.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 16:55, Richard Crisp wrote:
SNR can be increased by taking more and longer exposures as long as the exposure doesn’t saturate

You continue to win using longer exposures if your dark signal from the longer exposure has less shot noise than the single exposure’s read noise: once the dark shot noise exceeds the read noise, longer exposures will reduce the SNR. Cooling controls this.

Multiple images stacked imposes no limit to how low you can drive the noise in the stack, thereby increasing the SNR up to the point of zero noise (unachievable)

Sorry but that’s how it works


“Corrected” by my iPhone

On May 1, 2021, at 1:18 AM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



Rolando,

I am not sure I agree here. We both know that an easy and effective method to increase S/N is to stack multiple images. As for aperture impacting light flux, I would agree here for objects with a low surface brightness but, again, we have many targets where aperture (and absolute light flux) is not necessarily the only solution.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 02:23, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
F-ratio means nothing. Aperture is the deciding parameter that determines light flux arriving at the detector. More light = more signal to noise.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: ayiomamitis <anthony@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 5:05 pm
Subject: Re: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Rolando,
Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.
Anthony.
On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Richard Crisp
 

SNR can be increased by taking more and longer exposures as long as the exposure doesn’t saturate

You continue to win using longer exposures if your dark signal from the longer exposure has less shot noise than the single exposure’s read noise: once the dark shot noise exceeds the read noise, longer exposures will reduce the SNR. Cooling controls this.

Multiple images stacked imposes no limit to how low you can drive the noise in the stack, thereby increasing the SNR up to the point of zero noise (unachievable)

Sorry but that’s how it works


“Corrected” by my iPhone

On May 1, 2021, at 1:18 AM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



Rolando,

I am not sure I agree here. We both know that an easy and effective method to increase S/N is to stack multiple images. As for aperture impacting light flux, I would agree here for objects with a low surface brightness but, again, we have many targets where aperture (and absolute light flux) is not necessarily the only solution.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 02:23, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
F-ratio means nothing. Aperture is the deciding parameter that determines light flux arriving at the detector. More light = more signal to noise.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: ayiomamitis <anthony@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 5:05 pm
Subject: Re: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Rolando,
Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.
Anthony.
On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

Hi Pete,

I have been AWOL from the group due to a lack of imaging from home as a result of light pollution and which has amputated me the worst possible way.

With my work this summer, something I have been meaning to pursue for many years now involves the constellations themselves and which explains the acquisition of the StarAdventurer portable mount and the various Pentax 67 lenses.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 02:24, Pete Lardizabal wrote:
Great to hear from you Anthony!

Looking forward to your future experiments. I'm tempted to try some rudimentary “pin hole” or camera obscura work with one of my digital cameras. 

😉

Pete

On Apr 30, 2021, at 7:06 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



PS. Sorry for the wrong link. This is what I meant to send: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Solar-Scenes-Equinox-20200313.htm and/or http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Solar-Scenes-Equinox-20180919.htm .

On 01-May-21 02:04, Anthony Ayiomamitis wrote:

Robert et al,

Last summer I had a very brief window of opportunity when the measures against the coronavirus were eased so as to help the local tourism industry. In order to control possible depth of field issues, I shot the following at f8 using a lens I picked up for $30: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Star-Trails-Aegina-Mother-2020.htm .... you will not believe the sharpness when looking at the hires version and where the whole image comes to life. I picked up this lens used on eBay over 15 years ago to go along with my EOS 300D back then (I got the lens discounted since the autofocus on the lens was not working and which was/is a nonissue for me).

If my go to scope is my AP160 at f7.5, what is wrong with shooting at f7.1 or f8 with more orthodox optics including Pentax 67 lenses and my $30 EOS 50mm/f1.8? I have some really sweet results using the standard kit lens (EF-S 18-55/f3.5-f5.6) which is a throw-in when buying many Canon EOS camera bodies. I am anal retentive when it comes to focusing - be it a telescope or a 40-yr Pentax 67 lens - and I am rewarded with razor sharp results each time.

Back this summer with results under the night sky.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:47, ROBERT WYNNE wrote:
I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:
 
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

Rolando,

I am not sure I agree here. We both know that an easy and effective method to increase S/N is to stack multiple images. As for aperture impacting light flux, I would agree here for objects with a low surface brightness but, again, we have many targets where aperture (and absolute light flux) is not necessarily the only solution.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 02:23, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
F-ratio means nothing. Aperture is the deciding parameter that determines light flux arriving at the detector. More light = more signal to noise.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: ayiomamitis <anthony@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 5:05 pm
Subject: Re: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Rolando,
Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.
Anthony.
On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


alan.dang@...
 

Among vintage lenses, I was impressed with the figure (contrast/sharpness) of the Canon FD 800/5.6L but there is still a lot of residual purple fringing.

Ciel et Espace tested the Pentax SDUF II (400mm f4) and reported a 
 PV.        RMS
 λ/1.9   λ/10 red
 λ/1.9   λ/13 green
 λ/1.8   λ/10 blue

which doesn’t sound great and the camera lenses were probably worse.  I do know that portrait lenses often have some residual SA intentionally to generate more pleasant out of focus areas.

The Vixen VSD100 does measure better
PV.        RMS
 λ/2.7   λ/12.4 red
 λ/3.0   λ/15.5 green
 λ/4.1   λ/24 blue
and a 110 micron spread in chromatic aberration 


These numbers don’t look great at face value but 
their measurement of the Takahashi FSQ106n was
PV.        RMS
 λ/2.3  λ/12.2 red
 λ/2.9  λ/15.3 green
 λ/4.0   λ/18 blue
and a 200 micron spread in chromatic aberration

and the Televue NP101is
PV.        RMS
 λ/4.6 λ/25 red
 λ/3.5  λ/19 green
 λ/2.5   λ/12 blue
and a 200 micron spread in chromatic aberration

These clearly have worse measurements than any AP but the widefield is nice.

Alan


Pete Lardizabal
 

Great to hear from you Anthony!

Looking forward to your future experiments. I'm tempted to try some rudimentary “pin hole” or camera obscura work with one of my digital cameras. 

😉

Pete

On Apr 30, 2021, at 7:06 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



PS. Sorry for the wrong link. This is what I meant to send: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Solar-Scenes-Equinox-20200313.htm and/or http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Solar-Scenes-Equinox-20180919.htm .

On 01-May-21 02:04, Anthony Ayiomamitis wrote:

Robert et al,

Last summer I had a very brief window of opportunity when the measures against the coronavirus were eased so as to help the local tourism industry. In order to control possible depth of field issues, I shot the following at f8 using a lens I picked up for $30: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Star-Trails-Aegina-Mother-2020.htm .... you will not believe the sharpness when looking at the hires version and where the whole image comes to life. I picked up this lens used on eBay over 15 years ago to go along with my EOS 300D back then (I got the lens discounted since the autofocus on the lens was not working and which was/is a nonissue for me).

If my go to scope is my AP160 at f7.5, what is wrong with shooting at f7.1 or f8 with more orthodox optics including Pentax 67 lenses and my $30 EOS 50mm/f1.8? I have some really sweet results using the standard kit lens (EF-S 18-55/f3.5-f5.6) which is a throw-in when buying many Canon EOS camera bodies. I am anal retentive when it comes to focusing - be it a telescope or a 40-yr Pentax 67 lens - and I am rewarded with razor sharp results each time.

Back this summer with results under the night sky.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:47, ROBERT WYNNE wrote:
I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:
 
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Roland Christen
 

F-ratio means nothing. Aperture is the deciding parameter that determines light flux arriving at the detector. More light = more signal to noise.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: ayiomamitis <anthony@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 5:05 pm
Subject: Re: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Rolando,
Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.
Anthony.
On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

On 01-May-21 02:04, Anthony Ayiomamitis wrote:

Robert et al,

Last summer I had a very brief window of opportunity when the measures against the coronavirus were eased so as to help the local tourism industry. In order to control possible depth of field issues, I shot the following at f8 using a lens I picked up for $30: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Star-Trails-Aegina-Mother-2020.htm .... you will not believe the sharpness when looking at the hires version and where the whole image comes to life. I picked up this lens used on eBay over 15 years ago to go along with my EOS 300D back then (I got the lens discounted since the autofocus on the lens was not working and which was/is a nonissue for me).

If my go to scope is my AP160 at f7.5, what is wrong with shooting at f7.1 or f8 with more orthodox optics including Pentax 67 lenses and my $30 EOS 50mm/f1.8? I have some really sweet results using the standard kit lens (EF-S 18-55/f3.5-f5.6) which is a throw-in when buying many Canon EOS camera bodies. I am anal retentive when it comes to focusing - be it a telescope or a 40-yr Pentax 67 lens - and I am rewarded with razor sharp results each time.

Back this summer with results under the night sky.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:47, ROBERT WYNNE wrote:
I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:
 
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

Robert et al,

Last summer I had a very brief window of opportunity when the measures against the coronavirus were eased so as to help the local tourism industry. In order to control possible depth of field issues, I shot the following at f8 using a lens I picked up for $30: http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Star-Trails-Aegina-Mother-2020.htm .... you will not believe the sharpness when looking at the hires version and where the whole image comes to life. I picked up this lens used on eBay over 15 years ago to go along with my EOS 300D back then (I got the lens discounted since the autofocus on the lens was not working and which was/is a nonissue for me).

If my go to scope is my AP160 at f7.5, what is wrong with shooting at f7.1 or f8 with more orthodox optics including Pentax 67 lenses and my $30 EOS 50mm/f1.8? I have some really sweet results using the standard kit lens (EF-S 18-55/f3.5-f5.6) which is a throw-in when buying many Canon EOS camera bodies. I am anal retentive when it comes to focusing - be it a telescope or a 40-yr Pentax 67 lens - and I am rewarded with razor sharp results each time.

Back this summer with results under the night sky.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:47, ROBERT WYNNE wrote:
I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:
 
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Richard Crisp
 

No problem there Anthony except I did this about 15 years ago and I don’t see myself repeating the exercise. I’m just offering up what I have that I think is relevant.

 

 

 

From: main@ap-ug.groups.io <main@ap-ug.groups.io> On Behalf Of ROBERT WYNNE
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2021 3:47 PM
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; ayiomamitis <anthony@...>
Subject: Re: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

 

I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert

On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

 

 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:

Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone



On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:

Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

 

Rolando

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap

 

Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results

 

You might find the slide deck useful that I made

 

 

I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ROBERT WYNNE
 

I was always taught the widest aperture was the worst aperture to capture a sharp image due a number of factors. The median apertures F5.6 - F8-11 were optimum unless you entered a F 64 club contest and then everything had to be in sharp focus plus a full range of black to white tones in the photograph. That did not include the selection of a subject of artistic merit. Then all criterion were met it was said you had a worthy photograph. All this technique has been lost over the years. -Best, Robert

On 04/30/2021 3:32 PM ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:
 
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

Richard,

My RHA is at f3.8, my Tak FSQ is at f5 and my 130GT is at f6.3. I think a better (and fairer) comparison involving the Pentax 67 lenses would be at similar f/rations. Shooting wide open is effectively begging for a biased comparison. If we are happy shooting at f5 (ex FSQ), I am sure we can be equally happy shooting at f5 (or something close to it) with a Pentax 67 lens.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:15, Richard Crisp wrote:
Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


ayiomamitis
 

Gents,

I have attached some test shots from about three years ago using my EOS 6D (modified) with the Pentax 67 200/f4 (with/without the Pentax 67 2x converter). I have more examples which are really sweet but I will have to dig around the hard disk.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 01:05, Anthony Ayiomamitis wrote:

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Richard Crisp
 

Note the lens tests I posted were shot at several different f/ratios 

“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 3:05 PM, ayiomamitis <anthony@...> wrote:



Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Richard Crisp
 

I completely get it!

They are useless for color 

However they do work fine with mono sensors and emission line filters stopped down

I had an experiment I wanted to try but never did: I wanted to put an IR-cut and a UV-cut filter in series and try some color imaging and see if it improved any

The blue end was terrible with star bloat

This is an example


The ED type gave better results


But I still would like to cut both ends of the visible

With mono sensors and narrowband filters they make a dandy method to find PNe.

They stand out like a sore thumb


But with Ha I think they do pretty well if you have a mono sensor and can focus it well.

The thing I liked about them was the long back focus and the fairly large “sweet spot” for illumination of sensors a lot smaller than a 6x7 negative 

The back focus allowed an inline focuser to be used vs a belt drive etc like is usually used when 35mm type lenses are used 



“Corrected” by my iPhone

On Apr 30, 2021, at 2:48 PM, Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:


Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).
 
 
From: main@ap-ug.groups.io <main@ap-ug.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roland Christen via groups.io
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2021 12:44 PM
To: robert-wynne@...; main@ap-ug.groups.io; chris1011@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
 
I did get an adapter for my 90mm focal length lens from the Pentax 6x7 medium format film camera. It's a very fast lens wide open F2.8, so I thought it would make an ideal wide field imaging system with either my Sony NEX7 digital camera or my astronomical CCD camera. Well, my first shot wide open produced 100 micron bloated stars in the center with quite severe chromatic aberration. Stopping it down to F8 helped some, but didn't really clean up until F11. At that point it had an aperture of only 8mm, not much more than a dark adapted human eyeball. So, pretty much none of the older film camera lenses, no matter how good they were back then, will hold a candle to a modern lens designed for a digital camera. Even a cheap and cheerful Rokinon will blow these old dinosaurs away.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 12:36 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
It's really a shame that all these high end lenses are relegated to museum shelves. Someone ought to figure out some sort of adapter. I must have over 20k in lenses I can't seem to let go of. I was a Canon F1 fan. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 10:13 AM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:
 
 
I have a collection of Nikon and Pentax film cameras that sit unused on my "museum" shelves. It's a pity really. Couple of years back i bought some rolls of 120 color film and shot some pictures of our prairie. Even with the medium format film I could see the graininess that limited the resolution. It's like a factor of 10 in resolution gain of CCD/digital over film.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ross Elkins <rossmon1@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 11:57 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
I had to console many a sad photographer! I managed a photo shop, “Milbee Photo Stores” part of a chain of 20 or so small shops where the nicest camera was made by Kodak and film processing was the profit center.
I was doing wedding/bar mitzvah photography and many of my pals were the top fashion photographers of the day.
I bought n sold 35mm cameras that came in the front door! Nikons F’s, the Olympus OM1, the Fugi 120 with the 120 negative. Our pal Hideoki Hagiwara was Japans most famous photographer at the time. On a trip to Tokyo, he brought back an Olympus Pen F ½ frame for each one of us! Him and My pal Paul Hyman had a large studio at 100 Fifth Ave, what an address! Almost across the street from Max’s Kansas City where all the photo/music/artists elite hung. Paul has a photo project from the atlas mountain tribes that is part of the MET’s permanent collection!
I still have my Pen F with a couple of lenses! I gave that life up for almost famous music and a California life in 1974!
 
Ross
 
 
 
 
 


ayiomamitis
 

Rolando,

Why shoot wide open (say f2.8) when our astrographs are f4 or slightly slower? I would rather see results at such f-ratios (ex f4 to f6.3) so that results can be that much more comparable.

Anthony.

On 01-May-21 00:48, Roland Christen via groups.io wrote:
Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).


Roland Christen
 

Try shooting stars wide open with a color digital chip. You will see the limitations. I wish I had kept the result of my 90mm F2.8 Pentax lens - you would not believe how bad it is wide open.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 3:28 pm
Subject: Takumar Pentax 6x7 tests RE: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap
 
Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results
 
You might find the slide deck useful that I made
 
 
I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).
 
 
From: main@ap-ug.groups.io <main@ap-ug.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roland Christen via groups.io
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2021 12:44 PM
To: robert-wynne@...; main@ap-ug.groups.io; chris1011@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
 
I did get an adapter for my 90mm focal length lens from the Pentax 6x7 medium format film camera. It's a very fast lens wide open F2.8, so I thought it would make an ideal wide field imaging system with either my Sony NEX7 digital camera or my astronomical CCD camera. Well, my first shot wide open produced 100 micron bloated stars in the center with quite severe chromatic aberration. Stopping it down to F8 helped some, but didn't really clean up until F11. At that point it had an aperture of only 8mm, not much more than a dark adapted human eyeball. So, pretty much none of the older film camera lenses, no matter how good they were back then, will hold a candle to a modern lens designed for a digital camera. Even a cheap and cheerful Rokinon will blow these old dinosaurs away.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 12:36 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
It's really a shame that all these high end lenses are relegated to museum shelves. Someone ought to figure out some sort of adapter. I must have over 20k in lenses I can't seem to let go of. I was a Canon F1 fan. -Best, Robert
On 04/30/2021 10:13 AM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:
 
 
I have a collection of Nikon and Pentax film cameras that sit unused on my "museum" shelves. It's a pity really. Couple of years back i bought some rolls of 120 color film and shot some pictures of our prairie. Even with the medium format film I could see the graininess that limited the resolution. It's like a factor of 10 in resolution gain of CCD/digital over film.
 
Rolando
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ross Elkins <rossmon1@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 11:57 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty
I had to console many a sad photographer! I managed a photo shop, “Milbee Photo Stores” part of a chain of 20 or so small shops where the nicest camera was made by Kodak and film processing was the profit center.
I was doing wedding/bar mitzvah photography and many of my pals were the top fashion photographers of the day.
I bought n sold 35mm cameras that came in the front door! Nikons F’s, the Olympus OM1, the Fugi 120 with the 120 negative. Our pal Hideoki Hagiwara was Japans most famous photographer at the time. On a trip to Tokyo, he brought back an Olympus Pen F ½ frame for each one of us! Him and My pal Paul Hyman had a large studio at 100 Fifth Ave, what an address! Almost across the street from Max’s Kansas City where all the photo/music/artists elite hung. Paul has a photo project from the atlas mountain tribes that is part of the MET’s permanent collection!
I still have my Pen F with a couple of lenses! I gave that life up for almost famous music and a California life in 1974!
 
Ross
 
 
 
 
 


Richard Crisp
 

Some years back I did some tests of a handful of Pentax6x7 lenses I had picked up on the cheap

 

Even though they aren’t very well corrected over an electronic imager’s broad spectral responsivity, it seemed if you stopped them down, used a single wavelength filter with a mono sensor, you could get pretty decent results

 

You might find the slide deck useful that I made

 

http://www.narrowbandimaging.com/images/pentax_67_lens_tests.pdf

 

I was using an FLI ML4022 camera (KAI series sensor w/7.4 micron interline pixels).

 

 

From: main@ap-ug.groups.io <main@ap-ug.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roland Christen via groups.io
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2021 12:44 PM
To: robert-wynne@...; main@ap-ug.groups.io; chris1011@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

 

I did get an adapter for my 90mm focal length lens from the Pentax 6x7 medium format film camera. It's a very fast lens wide open F2.8, so I thought it would make an ideal wide field imaging system with either my Sony NEX7 digital camera or my astronomical CCD camera. Well, my first shot wide open produced 100 micron bloated stars in the center with quite severe chromatic aberration. Stopping it down to F8 helped some, but didn't really clean up until F11. At that point it had an aperture of only 8mm, not much more than a dark adapted human eyeball. So, pretty much none of the older film camera lenses, no matter how good they were back then, will hold a candle to a modern lens designed for a digital camera. Even a cheap and cheerful Rokinon will blow these old dinosaurs away.

 

Rolando

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 12:36 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

It's really a shame that all these high end lenses are relegated to museum shelves. Someone ought to figure out some sort of adapter. I must have over 20k in lenses I can't seem to let go of. I was a Canon F1 fan. -Best, Robert

On 04/30/2021 10:13 AM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:

 

 

I have a collection of Nikon and Pentax film cameras that sit unused on my "museum" shelves. It's a pity really. Couple of years back i bought some rolls of 120 color film and shot some pictures of our prairie. Even with the medium format film I could see the graininess that limited the resolution. It's like a factor of 10 in resolution gain of CCD/digital over film.

 

Rolando

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Ross Elkins <rossmon1@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Apr 30, 2021 11:57 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] A colorful Southern Sky Beauty

I had to console many a sad photographer! I managed a photo shop, “Milbee Photo Stores” part of a chain of 20 or so small shops where the nicest camera was made by Kodak and film processing was the profit center.

I was doing wedding/bar mitzvah photography and many of my pals were the top fashion photographers of the day.

I bought n sold 35mm cameras that came in the front door! Nikons F’s, the Olympus OM1, the Fugi 120 with the 120 negative. Our pal Hideoki Hagiwara was Japans most famous photographer at the time. On a trip to Tokyo, he brought back an Olympus Pen F ½ frame for each one of us! Him and My pal Paul Hyman had a large studio at 100 Fifth Ave, what an address! Almost across the street from Max’s Kansas City where all the photo/music/artists elite hung. Paul has a photo project from the atlas mountain tribes that is part of the MET’s permanent collection!

I still have my Pen F with a couple of lenses! I gave that life up for almost famous music and a California life in 1974!

 

Ross